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ablebodiedman
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 Our Hope - 2005/08/11 00:46 Hello Brother Wheeler,

After reading your article Chapter 37 and 38 of Ezekiel seem more concurrent.

I read the article on your site and need to do more study before I feel comfortable about reaching similar conclusions. There are some scriptures which now seem to fit the puzzle with the idea you have presented.

"Revelation 5:10 actually says in Greek that they will rule ON (not OVER) the earth."

Would that include Jesus or is he the 144,001st ?

What Jesus said at Matthew 26:29 now seems literal:

"29 But I tell YOU, I will by no means drink henceforth any of this product of the vine until that day when I drink it new with YOU in the kingdom of my Father.”

I might say;"the next round is on me" however, with 144,001 that would be expensive.



I suspect "the bible student" who brought this up was Eli Waters or "Harmony" of the YORWW congregation.

I have had a small interchange with him on this subject also.

The only problem with this is the thought that Jesus might once again be on the earth in human form. This would fly in the face of YORWW doctrine and could get him in big trouble.

If you come across any more collateral for this new understanding please let me (us) know.

regards

ablebodiedman

Post edited by: ablebodiedman, at: 2005/08/11 00:53
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Patrick
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 Re:Our Hope - 2005/08/11 06:04 Hi Ablebodiedman,

I suspect "the bible student" who brought this up was Eli Waters or "Harmony" of the YORWW congregation.
I have had a small interchange with him on this subject also.
The only problem with this is the thought that Jesus might once again be on the earth in human form. This would fly in the face of YORWW doctrine and could get him in big trouble.


I'm not sure I remember, if we had this conversation or not...but it certainly is an interesting topic. Yes, it is true I am in concert and harmony in thought with the YORWW Congregation and what they teach. Actually this is the proper course, that Paul recommended for a united congregation. So, I'm happy to be in unity with the YORWW Congregation. (1 Cor. 1:10)

I agree that Rev. 5:10 actually says: the "kings and priests" of God, will indeed rule ON THE EARTH, just as the verse clearly says. And we know the WTS doesn't teach this, since they believe the 144,000 will rule from the heavens, and not the earth. The YORWW does teach, God's Kingdom will be on the earth...But we don't think Jesus is coming back in the flesh...since that would contradict so many obvious verses that I am aware of. Of course, maybe you have verses that say different. If so, I would be interested hearing exactly what proof you can present to say that Jesus is coming back in the flesh.

But, there is one verse that stands out to me, that I think bears some light on this subject. Its a verse that the YORWW repeatedly emphasizes...its the verse at Acts 3:20, 21. It states relative to Jesus' return to earth the following,

"and that he may send forth the Christ appointed for you, Jesus, whom HEAVEN, INDEED MUST HOLD WITHIN ITSELF until the times of restoration of all things of which God spoke through the mouth of his holy prophets of old."

Would you say, Jesus is coming back to earth....BEFORE the "restoration of all things"...or AFTER...which?... based upon what this verse says?

I will await your reply.

Thanks,

Eli Waters

Post edited by: EliW, at: 2005/08/12 14:33
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ablebodiedman
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 Re:Our Hope - 2005/08/11 10:09 EliW wrote:

But, there is one verse that stands out to me, that I think bears some light on this subject. Its a verse that the YORWW repeatedly emphasizes...its the verse at Acts 3:20, 21. It states relative to Jesus' return to earth the following,

"and that he may send forth the Christ appointed for you, Jesus, whom HEAVEN, INDEED MUST HOLD WITHIN ITSELF until the times of restoration of all things of which God spoke through the mouth of his holy prophets of old."




Hello Eli,


"whom Heaven, indeed must hold within itself UNTIL the times of restoration"


Notice that I capitalized and underlined a different word in the verse you quoted.

UNTIL

This suggests that at the time of restoration heaven would no longer hold Jesus within itself.

This verse harmonizes nicely with the words at Psalm, 110:1

1 The utterance of Jehovah to my Lord is:“Sit at my right hand Until I place your enemies as a stool for your feet.”


So heaven will hold Jesus until he is sent forth (out of heaven) to subdue his enemies.


Psalm 110:2

2 The rod of your strength Jehovah will send out of Zion, [saying:]
“Go subduing in the midst of your enemies.”


Jesus at this point should be able to come and go as he pleases.

This is what the inspired Apostle John heard Jesus himself say:

John 10:17-18

17 This is why the Father loves me, because I surrender my soul, in order that I may receive it again. 18 No man has taken it away from me, but I surrender it of my own initiative. I have authority to surrender it, and I have authority to receive it again. The commandment on this I received from my Father.”


If Jesus is going to drink wine again with his annointed brothers in the kingdom which will rule on the earth I think he will need to be in human form (a soul) to do this unless angels are able to drink wine in their spiritual form.

I hope this has helped guide you into the truth of this matter.


regards

ablebodiedman

Post edited by: ablebodiedman, at: 2005/08/14 05:46
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