Two cents on reform... - 2005/07/31 13:26It's all well and good that some of the Witnesses want reform.
But here's a suggestion...
Start your own religion.
I laughed to myself when I read that you are hoping for 100 signatures.
The society will send out 100 letters of disfellowshipment to you congregations and be done with it.
You need something like 25 thousand.
Even then... the society has at times said that about 25 thousand get df'ed every year. Does that cause them to think about changing things to meet the ideas of the 25 thousand... to make it easier for them? Nope.
You are never going to get the WT to change anything. To them you all sound like Korah, Dathan and Abirum. You won't make a dent on anything.
It's much better to break away and form your own group.
Anyway.. I wish you all good luck.
J
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polemotheos
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Posts: 530
Re:Two cents on reform... - 2005/07/31 14:20mjhts, Thank you for your thoughts... Much of what you say is true. However, we already have thousands of active Jehovah's witnesses internet witnessing on forums accross the internet.
This is clearly discouraged by the WTBTS. This is growing every year even with all the condemnation. The fact is the corporation is losing it's power and strangle hold over the truth. This will only continue.
Even if they do not reform as you say... it matters not. In the reformed paradigm the corporation no longer matters as much,... it is no longer a god.
None the less the words of the reform movement are needed to have a vision. For "Where there is no vision, the people perish..." (Pro 29:18)
We are on the path to living the change we want to see. You can say it is a new religion (re-connection with God) if you wish.
Re:Two cents on reform... - 2005/08/01 12:36mjhts wrote: You are never going to get the WT to change anything. To them you all sound like Korah, Dathan and Abirum. You won't make a dent on anything. Have you noticed that the watchtower has changed it's policy on vaccines, organ transplants and blood over the years? Why do you think that is?
It is do to individual Jehovah's witnesses taking a stand for what they believe in. Many may think this "new light" comes from angels who speak to the governing body. But the fact is, it is brothers and sisters that many watchtower worshipers would call Korah, Dathan and Abirum. Contrary to what they brain wash us with, Jesus is the Greater Moses not the governing body nor the watchtower corporation.
Re:Two cents on reform... - 2005/08/02 08:38polemotheos wrote: mjhts wrote: You are never going to get the WT to change anything. To them you all sound like Korah, Dathan and Abirum. You won't make a dent on anything. Have you noticed that the watchtower has changed it's policy on vaccines, organ transplants and blood over the years? Why do you think that is?
It is do to individual Jehovah's witnesses taking a stand for what they believe in. Many may think this "new light" comes from angels who speak to the governing body. But the fact is, it is brothers and sisters that many watchtower worshipers would call Korah, Dathan and Abirum. Contrary to what they brain wash us with, Jesus is the Greater Moses not the governing body nor the watchtower corporation.<br><br>Post edited by: polemotheos, at: 2005/08/01 12:39
Here is my 2 cents:
I think the leadership of "the organization" will be destroyed with only a small remnant left to continue. In this way "the organization" will be reformed and not replaced.
The reformation will be more drastic and thorough than simply changing a few unpopular polices and doctrines through a grass roots movement.
It will first be done away with simply by the truth.
2 Thessalonians 2:8
"whom the Lord Jesus will do away with by the spirit of his mouth"
I suspect these truths will be found and dispensed through the internet wilderness as well as by word of mouth. This I believe is just now starting to happen. This may indeed start through a grass roots movement.
After a great deal of suffering by the righteous the evil elements in "the organization" will be destroyed (brought to nothing 2Th2:8) by Jesus's angels.
Matthew 13:41
41 The Son of man will send forth his angels, and they will collect out from his kingdom all things that cause stumbling and persons who are doing lawlessness, 42 and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where [their] weeping and the gnashing of [their] teeth will be. 43 At that time the righteous ones will shine as brightly as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Let him that has ears listen.
Notice that the remnant will somehow be glorified in such a way that they will easily become recognised. These are the ones who are not deceived by the "evil slave" but remained faithfull to the truth.
Not only will the evil slave be forcefully removed by angels, those elders who were delegated by the evil slave will be removed by angels also.
I am certain the rough treatment and injustices that Polemotheos endured will be completely vindicated.
Once these elders are removed there will be great joy in the congregations for those few who remain.
This joy is mentioned in the following very old scripture whose prophecy is still waiting to be literally fullfilled:
Isaiah 29
19 And the meek ones will certainly increase their rejoicing in Jehovah himself, and even the poor ones of mankind will be joyful in the Holy One of Israel himself, 20 because the (---elders)
tyrant must reach his end, and the bragger must come to his finish, and all those keeping alert to do harm must be cut off, 21 those bringing a man into sin by [his] word, and those who lay bait even for the one reproving in the gate, and those who push aside the righteous one with empty arguments.
OK, I will throw in another cent making it my three cents.
Once this occurs the very old prophecy mentioned in Daniel and tied to some very interesting chronology will also be literally fulfilled:
Daniel 12
12 “Happy is the one who is keeping in expectation and who arrives at the one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days!
Here is another thought regarding the scripture at Daniel 12:12
Who is expecting this?
I hope everyone agrees that mainstream Jehovah's Witnesses are not expecting this to happen and will be completely surprised, shocked and stumbled when it does.
Certainly those of you who have read and understood this post will be expecting this and will be overjoyed when you see it start to happen.
I think that only a very few (a small remnant) are expecting what I have described above to happen.
Please now take time to consider what the Apostle Paul wrote to the Romans in regards to the literal fulfillment of some very old prophecy:
Romans 9
25 It is as he says also in Ho·se´a: “Those not my people I will call ‘my people,’ and her who was not beloved ‘beloved’; 26 and in the place where it was said to them, ‘YOU are not my people,’ there they will be called ‘sons of the living God.’”
27 Moreover, Isaiah cries out concerning Israel: “Although the number of the sons of Israel may be as the sand of the sea, it is the remnant that will be saved. 28 For Jehovah will make an accounting on the earth, concluding it and cutting it short.”
regards
ablebodiedman
Post edited by: ablebodiedman, at: 2005/08/03 02:43
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ablebodiedman
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Posts: 353
Re:Two cents on reform... - 2005/08/02 09:2826 and in the place where it was said to them, ‘YOU are not my people,’ there they will be called ‘sons of the living God.’”
Ok, here is another making it 4 cents
Actually, I think this is about a $100 worth however, am certain many will contend.
If someone who had faith in the truth rebelled against the evil slave and was disfellowshipped or disassociated himself he would be amoungst those who were told; "you are not my people".
Isn't that what disfellowshipping is?
The organization telling you that you are no longer one of them.
So where is "the place where it was said to them"?
Answer:
The Kingdom Hall
That is why I think it will be a reformation because the same Kingdom Halls will remain only the ones being given honour inside them will be completely different and unexpected.
So there is no need to start a new religion.
The old one is going to be drastically reformed.
regards
ablebodiedman
Post edited by: ablebodiedman, at: 2005/08/02 09:38
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mjhts
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Posts: 2
Re:Two cents on reform... - 2005/08/02 14:25You know... you speak of the Evil Slave.
To the majority of JW's, we're Evil Slaves.
Do you realize how repugnant it would sound to the majority of rank and file JW's if you insinuate that the present leadership is the Evil Slave.
Hmmm... too bad I missed the Convention this past weekend. There's another one coming up... I'm going to see if I can go. I bet that without fail they'll mention something about not going online. I want to see if this movement has gotten their attention.
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