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Re:Thinking of conversion - what say ye? - 2005/03/20 02:34 Thdurand,

Get God's opinion on it.

Everyone here will only advise you according to our past experiences and beliefs. Get God's opinion.

Literally, get on your face before Yah. Tell him you want to serve him and that you will pay the price. Ask him to take you at your word if you're unsure whether your heart really means this. (It took me about six years from the day I said I would pay the price, to the day I started to understand what it actually meant)

Ask God to lead you. Ask him to watch over you. God may not lead with a column of fire or cloud of smoke these days, but he can lead just as clearly if you let him. (more clearly because we have the holy spirit)

Learn to hear God. This is what I tell everyone who asks me for ministary. Learn to hear him for yourself and don't make a move until you have.

Then, once you have God's opinion and direction, you can step forward boldly and in faith. Remember, "anything not done in faith is done in sin" so if you go with doubts to the KH, you go in sin. When you move in faith, you leave your doubts behind you.

Much love and shalom.
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Re:Thinking of conversion - what say ye? - 2005/03/20 06:43 Hi All

Thanks very much for all of the replies. I will be getting my Watchtower today and I appreciate your thoughts and comments, all of which I will bear in mind.

I am actually Catholic and not a fallen away one - I am quite active in sofar as one can be. That said, I am not sure if anyone on this board would consider that a valid baptism, altough I consider myself to have lived it.

Being Catholic, I am circumspect about hierarchical, secretive religious organizations that have difficulty remedying things that are obviously wrong in light of the Word and lying when confronted with the evidence of damage from them. Both Rome and Watchtower have a history of blown prophesies, cruel acts against their followers in the interest of preserving the status quo, and exclusive claims to salvation. I could add other many other bodies to this list but these are the two that are of immediate concern to me.

Readers may ask what has led me to the point where I am. What finally got me looking of the "reservation" was, I guess, the declaration of bankruptcy by some American Dioceses in an effort to protect them from legal liability for abusive clergy. This was a typically palmy and cowardly reaction of seeking redress and protection from the World rather than doing the right thing biblically - repent and restore, no questions asked, whatever the cost.

This contrasts sharply with what Watchtower presents itself to be. I have always had a great respect for the stands of individual Witnesses on matters that I feel my church is walking away from - nonviolence; public allegiance to God's kingdom proven by acts, not words; and inclusivity of all who believe on the Name regardless or race of status.

Studying the lessons of JW has further led me to evaluate the interpretation of scripturally obvious Christian beliefs in the context of the ethos and politics of the days of the Apostles and Fathers. So now I examine the trininty, professional clergy, paganization of christian ordinances, and continued tarnishing of the Good News by going to the centers of political and economic power to create and preserve things we can only do ourselves or force people to do things that only the spirit can draw them to.

So - I am receptive to the message but I really doubt that Watchtower, in its present state, is the vessel to carry it in. This makes me a poor candidate for membership regardless of baptism, wouldn't one think?

Post edited by: thdurand, at: 2005/03/20 09:25
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Re:Thinking of conversion - what say ye? - 2005/03/20 07:54 Hi thdurant.

Well I would certainly consider a Catholic baptism to be as valid as a JW one. As you say, you have also striven to live up to it. And if you don't consider it valid for some reason (perhaps because of it being an infant baptism?) then certainly you could be rebaptised. However, why be baptised AS anything but a Christian? Why be a denominational Christian? The JW baptismal procedure and questions are very much linked to identifying oneself as a member of an institution and as a "Jehovah's Witness". One of the three questions candidates are asked at their baptism (which question replaces the reference to the spirit in the Biblical formula "in the name of the Father and the Son and the holy spirit") is: "Do you you recognise that your baptism identifies you as a member of Jehovah's Witnesses?" (paraphrase). Is it "valid" to remove the Biblical reference to the spirit and baptise people in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society?

This contrasts sharply with what Watchtower presents itself to be.

You will find that there is quite a gulf between what the WT presents itself to be and what it is, I'm afraid. The phrase "jumping from the fying pan into the fire" occurs to me. Or perhaps from the fire into the frying pan, it depends on your perspective....either way...its bad. As you say, both organizations are corrupt in various ways. Though one of the ways in which the Catholic Church appears to be rather less corrupt than the WT (amazing as it may be to hear that phrase from one raised as a JW) is that it will allow it's members to hold their own beliefs and exercise a degree of freedom of speech. You can't do that and remain a Jehovah's Witness.

But as Ish said, these are really only our opinions. She gave the best advice when she said to prayerfully seek God's answer. Its the only one that counts.

Much Philia.

Phi.

Post edited by: Phi, at: 2005/03/20 07:55
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Re:Thinking of conversion - what say ye? - 2005/03/20 09:14 Hey -

Am I the only one here who can literally say I've been baptised in the Jordan????

Hurrah for me.

Shalom all.
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Re:Thinking of conversion - what say ye? - 2005/03/20 09:22 Hang on, Hang on! A bit too quick with your celebtations there Warrior!

I was baptised in the Jordan too! Well, I say baptised....I fell in....on a daytrip from the kibbutz I was working at. But its close!

Much Philia.

Phi.
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Re:Thinking of conversion - what say ye? - 2005/03/20 09:26 Immersion is immersion I guess.
Ok, you can be in my exclusive little club too then.

But only because it's you.
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